Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

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NeilV
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby NeilV » Thu Jul 23, 2015 1:16 pm

Neddy wrote:(4) You could do as I have done and link the manual Inverter On/Off switch to a really bright indicator light.

If you expect to hardly ever use this system, Option 4 is best. If you want it to run every time you run the engine, option 2 would be the best way to go.

Neville.


Thanks for the ongoing tips and teaching! :TU

I think this will be my best bet, and may also double as the input switchover reminder too, if I don't figure out how to switch the inverter input from this setup to house battery draw for 240v output without a plug swapping shuffle...
8.5m 1990 Dennis Dart bus, 6L turbo -4 pax
- 24v system: 2x 104ah AGM, 20a PWM controller 500W solar; 1200w puresine inverter
120L grey/fresh water, 75L compressor fridge, gas Califont, Diesel MK85 heater [awaiting install]

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NeilV
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby NeilV » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:43 pm

Outstanding questions from above...

1) "Can the 'dual charge' smart charger remain connected to both battery banks when inverter is running from starter batteries charging main like this, would that create a (minor) loop loss, or (major) short circuit issue?"

2) "inverter circuit will be needing to switch to working 'from house batteries to main breaker box required whenever shore power not available and 240v desired "
-what might this circuit look like when wired up to change over the intake current from the house batteries?
8.5m 1990 Dennis Dart bus, 6L turbo -4 pax
- 24v system: 2x 104ah AGM, 20a PWM controller 500W solar; 1200w puresine inverter
120L grey/fresh water, 75L compressor fridge, gas Califont, Diesel MK85 heater [awaiting install]

Neddy
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby Neddy » Fri Jul 24, 2015 10:33 pm

1) "Can the 'dual charge' smart charger remain connected to both battery banks when inverter is running from starter batteries charging main like this?"
The switching should be arranged to avoid any charger conflict, with no battery ever trying to charge itself.
House batteries are charged by the Smart charger running from Mains when available OR by the alternator/Starter battery powered Inverter running the Smart Charger when the engine is running.
Starter batteries are charged by the Mains powered Smart charger OR the alternator.

2) "Inverter circuit will be needing to switch to working from house batteries to main breaker box required whenever shore power not available and 240v desired. What might this circuit look like when wired up to change over the intake current from the house batteries?"
The simplest way to do this is by using a multipole 2-way centre-off rotary switch to switch all power sockets between Mains power input and Inverter power input. Alternatively it can be arranged such that some sockets/devices don't switch over to running from the Inverter. Usually these are high current items that would overload your inverter - microwaves, electric jugs, electric heaters, hot water cylinders and the like. The same switch is used to create any MEN link needed - your electrician will know all about this.

Neville.

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NeilV
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby NeilV » Sat Jul 25, 2015 1:18 pm

Neddy wrote:2) "Inverter circuit will be needing to switch to working from house batteries to main breaker box required whenever shore power not available and 240v desired. What might this circuit look like when wired up to change over the intake current from the house batteries?"
The simplest way to do this is by using a multipole 2-way centre-off rotary switch to switch all power sockets between Mains power input and Inverter power input. Alternatively it can be arranged such that some sockets/devices don't switch over to running from the Inverter. Usually these are high current items that would overload your inverter - microwaves, electric jugs, electric heaters, hot water cylinders and the like. The same switch is used to create any MEN link needed - your electrician will know all about this.
Neville.


Thanks again Neville (I was hoping you'd come back with your extensive knowledge input)

This question is more about the battery end (sparky can sort the breaker [MEN] end as I have to pay him anyway)
Specifically, for driving the inverter will be used to power the smart charger as suggested, so powered by the starter batteries/alternator...
For parked up living it needs to draw from the 'house batteries' it was charging before... So if sparky wires it to stop supplying charge to 240v plug charger was using while driving,

How do I wire the inverter to switch INPUT from flooded starting batteries to AGM 'house' batteries neatly?
8.5m 1990 Dennis Dart bus, 6L turbo -4 pax
- 24v system: 2x 104ah AGM, 20a PWM controller 500W solar; 1200w puresine inverter
120L grey/fresh water, 75L compressor fridge, gas Califont, Diesel MK85 heater [awaiting install]

lorry26
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby lorry26 » Sat Jul 25, 2015 3:43 pm

Interesting question as they have different charge voltages. Flooded boil dry at AGM charge rate.
'How do I wire the inverter to switch INPUT from flooded starting batteries to AGM 'house' batteries neatly?'
A smart charger should know the difference automatically when plugged into the inverter or land supply.

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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby Neddy » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:53 pm

Power management is controlled by two, two-way, three-position, Centre-Off, multi-pole rotary switches.
(1) This 2-way, 2-pole rotary switch is for the Inverter, controlling where its 24 volt input power comes from.
Its 3 positions are HOUSE BATTERY - OFF - STARTER BATTERY/Alternator.
The schematic diagram below shows how the same switch also controls the Inverter 230v Output, sending it to the mains power sockets when on House battery input and to the Charger when on Starter battery input, with the Charger output going to the House battery only.
Image

(2) This is a similar switch but it controls the 230v Power Source. Its 3 positions are MAINS - OFF - INVERTER.
Neil, I don't feel free to post this circuit, since that might be seen as enabling and encouraging people to illegally do their own 230v wiring.

Neville.

Rosemary&Peter
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby Rosemary&Peter » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:19 pm

FINALLY!

A picture!

I (almost) get it!

:TU :TU :TU

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NeilV
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Re: Electrical setup, options and answers, from scratch!

Postby NeilV » Sun Jul 26, 2015 12:35 am

Pic works great for me, thanks again! :TU

Just wondering now if I actually need 'shore' power for anything but battery hookup anyway (once we are on the road) :-T
8.5m 1990 Dennis Dart bus, 6L turbo -4 pax
- 24v system: 2x 104ah AGM, 20a PWM controller 500W solar; 1200w puresine inverter
120L grey/fresh water, 75L compressor fridge, gas Califont, Diesel MK85 heater [awaiting install]


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